Inspired Action For Imperfect Humans – S4 EP1: “It’s 2022 and You Are Actively Disengaged” Pt. 1

“It’s 2022 and You Are Actively Disengaged” Pt. 1 Brief Summary:

It’s 2022. As an employee, are you engaged in the workplace? Or are you actively disengaged? In part one of this Inspired Action For Imperfect Humans podcast episode, Hosts Kyle Kalloo and Christopher Lawrence deeply discuss engagement in the workplace, why employees in the workforce are actively disengaged, and offer some tips and solutions to creating a more engaging workplace.

“What we’ve seen is that the (employee) engagement is lower now than it was two years ago.”

“Here’s what the global employee engagement shows overall. 41% of employees globally. So 80 million responses, 41% are engaged.”


  • 2022 greeting
  • Christopher and Kyle review 2021
  • Unlimited vacation time
  • Engagement Vs. Disengagement
  • Statistics on employee engagement
  • “The Great Resignation” in Canada

Calls to Action:

Even before the remote workforce evolution, office culture was inherently fragile. After all, it’s made up of imperfect humans interacting with other imperfect humans. And while perfection isn’t the goal, we all secretly wish for a workplace where people find ways to bring out the best in each other. Unfortunately, that’s not always an intuitive skill. It takes guidance, practice, and then more guidance and practice… but with the right leadership, it’s definitely achievable. How do you enhance your workforce’s ability to engage, collaborate, and adapt in this volatile and uncertain reality? Get the answers to your culture questions when you setup a complimentary Discovery Session with Kyle Kalloo at

Not loving your career? Feel you need a change in your job? Let’s Strategize! Book a complimentary Strategy Session with Christopher Lawrence here:

Tell us your “inspired stories” stories by visiting

Christopher Lawrence LinkedIn:

Kyle Kalloo LinkedIn:

Change My Life Coaching & Change My Business Coaching LinkedIn:

Looking to create a corporate coaching culture? Reach out to Kyle Kalloo: [email protected]


“It’s 2022 and You Are Actively Disengaged” Pt. 1 Transcript:

[00:00:00] I’m sorry, all of these coaches that say coaching over the phone or coaching over zoom removes distractions, and you can get right to the point in it and it’s better. It’s better bullshit. You’re lying to yourself to make yourself feel better about coaching the way that you coach, because it is not the same is the thought of being imperfect, keeping you from taking action.

Welcome to inspired action for imperfect humans. Each week, we give you real life stories and thought provoking research that inspires your soul to live a more fulfilled life through your own actions. From the heart of Calgary Canada. Here are your hosts. Award-winning coaches, Christopher Lawrence and Kyle Calu happy new year to you.

Happy new year, happy new year. It is the start of a new year. The new season for us here on this podcast, season four, we want more give us season four and we hope it’s the start of a new attitude [00:01:00] for you for 2022. We’re hoping that listeners, oh, you’re so rude. I hope it’s the start of a new attitude for you, Kyle, because I know you weren’t talking about me.

Of course. Not, of course not.

like you, you seem really chilled today. Actually. Is this how New Year is going to be? Uh, let me tell you something. I am currently on day. I am currently on day five of, of a. Waking up at 3:00 AM and not being able to get back to sleep. And so I’m a bit punchy today. So watch out, watch out world punchy.

Although he says world, he’s talking about me, I’m usually the recipient. Oh, you’re my world’s Kyle. You know that. So after the dog, after my husband, after the business, after our employees, after our clients, you’re definitely somewhere in there. [00:02:00] Sometimes it’s just being on the list is important. So how was your year welcome to another year, dude?

Definitely have some battle wounds and battle scars.
Definitely have some battle wounds and battle scars.

Can you imagine? We made it through, there are some battle wounds and scars. I’ll tell you what, like, you know, it’s like, I think sometimes people look at us on social and you know, like our massive following of four people. And I think they look at us and sometimes. You know, that people develop impressions with what they see on social media.

For sure they do. I, I spent a lot of November and December reaching. Even October reaching out to people that I hadn’t reached out to in a long time. And they, um, it’s interesting because I, you know, I’m, I’m talking to them on the phone, just trying to catch up, you know, keep connections going and alive and whatever else, because you know, at some point in time you realize you have no friends left and, uh, and it’s amazing.

Like they’re all like, oh, you know, congratulations on all of your success. Congrats. And while I appreciate that, [00:03:00] You know, for me, it’s just another day. Uh, you know, it’s like, I do think that we are successful at what we do for sure, but I think that people sort of, they don’t see the whole picture and it’s like, yeah, it’s like, girl, our last two, like this last.

Two years. The last year has been like the first year of business it’s been like horrendous, it’s been hard. Right. And I think that people miss that and, you know, kind of it’s all the, the successes we’ve often said is always on the back of some failures. Right. It’s just, you know, that’s the other piece. And I think people see that and they celebrate that and make no mistake.

Cause who do you want to be celebrating? You’re a failure. Anyway. However, in retrospect, there’s moments that we say, you know what? I’m actually glad for that lesson. Now we know what we need to do. And like you were saying last two years of being for us to being there, to support other people, you know, We also experienced those pieces, you know, that, Hey, it wasn’t business as usual.

Like it was previous year, you know, we’re back to hunting for [00:04:00] businesses, we’re back to hunting, you know, revamping what we do. Right. And so that’s just what comes with it. And so it makes you kind of wonder why are we doing what we’re doing? You know, are we, are we destined for a nine to five gig? Should we just go with the day to day?

What does that even look like?

You know what I think that’s, that’s a really important point that you’re making. And I think that, um, it kind of alludes to this, um, thing that your coach actually posted up on social media in December Jamie Atkinson. Oh yeah. That’s brilliant. Yeah. So. He posted, he posted this up, so I’m going to read it.

Humans weren't made to sit at a desk?
Humans weren’t made to sit at a desk?

It says humans weren’t made to humans. Weren’t made to sit at a desk nine to five, come home every night to watch Netflix explore the world for only two weeks out of the year, have zero [00:05:00]creativity, have every single aspiration beat out of them. There’s so much more to life. Yeah, that was very impactful when I saw it.

Cause we’ve, we’ve talked about some of that as well. What’s your take on it? Like what jumped out for you when you read that? Well, it’s interesting because my immediate take is like, yes, yes, yes. Right. But I will also say. I am kind of sick of our meme world, where we take over, we take, we take complex concepts and boil them down into five statements on a meme.

So I appreciate what it evokes in me, but I think it it’s, it’s overstated. I’m sorry. There’s there’s office work out there and people have to do it and people have to make ends meet and not everybody’s going to make $10,000 by selling one off. Program, you know, to people that doesn’t work, you know, like, like not, everybody’s going to do that.

And, and most people don’t have access to it or know how to do it. I’m not saying don’t dream. What [00:06:00] I’m saying is I don’t like how it’s boiled down into something. So simple. Although I agree with the sentiment that the post has. I agree with the sentiment that the post has it, there there’s a sentiment to it that I think resonates with probably the vast majority of the population.

Yeah. What did you take for images or a group of people who just don’t want to do that anymore? You know, I think when they look at some people who, when we went to this online thing, everyone had to go to it right away. And as you know, with change, because change is hard, um, and simple is sometimes hard enough.

Not everyone picked up on it right away. What’s going on with your glasses dude. For some people. I’m drinking out of my jar and the other my glasses are fogging up, breathing into it. So I can have a first sip that it’s like, I’m getting into it. And all I see is I blinked and I saw are just [00:07:00] fogged up. I’m like, where are you?

Like. I have books. I read cutting this out cause I was just shocked anyway. Um, but I think, you know, when we moved into the online world, some of us had to do it right away. Some of us were already doing. But what I’m hearing from our clients cause you, you know, I think you had said something similar about your clients, but what I’m hearing from my clients is that for a lot of them, they’re like, I can’t do this constantly sitting at a desk all day.

Like it’s not the world I was in. It’s not what I was doing. I was shaking hands, kissing babies all the time, or I was so innovative. I was, I was connecting with people. I was, I was going out there. Right. And so now they’re questioning is if this is my world, That every day I come to work and I must be behind a computer, or if I’m at home doing the exact same thing, then what’s the point because they’re engagement

is really dropping. It’s funny because you’re the one that brought that post to me, but you love office work [00:08:00] like you, you know, so, so I, I think that the point behind the post, if I could say anything is if you were to take more of a bird’s eye view of it is that this is really about people kind of looking at the world.

From a different perspective and finding out what you value because what’s in that post is what Jamie values that’s what’s in a post is what he values. Some people value coming home and watching Netflix every night. Some people do. And it’s like, well, humans weren’t made to do that. And it’s like, well, humans weren’t really made to live in capitalism either.

That’s, that’s not a part of our evolutionary process that, you know, that’s, that’s human design. And, and, you know, I know the guy that made that post is definitely. In support of a capitalist society because of how he runs his business. Right? So I’m not bashing capitalism. I’m not saying that. I’m just saying I’m using it as an analogy.

Unlimited vacation, does it work?
Unlimited vacation, does it work?

Um, for this it’s two weeks away, two weeks, um, vacation as well, you know, for some people to [00:09:00] do it. I mean, my client yesterday, we had a great conversation as he’s thinking about his team and we were talking about the concept of unlimited. Vacation time. Right? Because we’re like, things happens throughout the year that people need to either step away to recharge and to come back.

And so the question is, well, if the work was getting done and things were moving in the right direction, do you care if they took two weeks, three weeks or four weeks of whatever, right. People do. But I will say, I will say though, like, like everyone thinks they want unlimited vacation, but do you know what the research has shown.

It’s showing that the employee benefit, sorry, the employer benefits more than the employee because when it’s unlimited vacation, the employee is more inclined to log in and check in and work longer hours when they have unlimited vacation. So actually what the research shows is that the employer is getting the better end of that deal.

What I will say is that I don’t think that two weeks is long enough for me personally. What’s interesting about it. I have [00:10:00] clients, Kyle I’ve worked with people. I had a client who she hit a, she hit a benchmark in her career where she got an extra week of vacation. And then she also had the opportunity to purchase an extra week of vacation.

And so you could do that and she didn’t, she didn’t, she actually didn’t want either, but she could only refuse the. Optional purchase. And I’m like, why? She says I won’t do anything with it. She says, I’ll be bored. I’d rather be at work. And so, so I just, you know, like I just think, you know, he makes a comment about like travel.

The world is like, I have clients that, that don’t care. Like it’s like, you know, I had a client who worked, um, uh, in Armenia. For, I dunno, it was, I think it was a couple years. Um, and everyone’s like, well, you’re there. You should go travel here, go travel there. He’s like, I have no interest. He’s like, I’m just here to do my job and come home and do what I’m going to do.

Not my value system, but he was quite [00:11:00] content doing it. Right. Right. He wasn’t morose about it or anything. And it makes you wonder that, and this is the thing that constantly come on. I’m not sure what the research is on this. I mean, I have my own experience about engagement, but we find people in the workforce are engaged

differently. Right. There’s certain people who, you know, value traveling the world. Like you were just saying certain people who don’t value, you know, traveling the world. Some people want more vacation. Some people want less vacation. Some people want meaningful work. Some people don’t want meaningful work.

And so as a leader, how do they actually navigate? Who wants what? Like what should they have a standard and then just go from there or should it be open to be flexible? Like what’s out there. What are people getting engaged? About because, well, I do have some stuff that I want to share, but I want to, I want to bring something to your attention.

Kyle, you promise people that we were going to go deeper on this podcast. And right now girls and boys, you’re listening to him and y’all know what I’m going to say. [00:12:00] This bitch is talking so theoretically from the front of her head, she ain’t going any deeper girl. She’s paying. I’m saying let’s start the conversation.

Cause I know you sometimes start the conversation. We’ve been here for 11 minutes. Knowing about the end. I’m asking you about engagement. What is, we’re going to talk about engagement, but when are you going to go deeper? You promise them that you’d go deeper. So . Why don’t you bring up something and I could get into he’s buying time.

He’s buying time. Okay. I’m going to get into this to see if I can save this episode. So, uh, um, I came across people. They can, if they’re on YouTube, uh, I came across, uh, global employee engagement data for 2020. So, uh, this was survey data, spending 80 million survey responses from 160 countries. And it’s as of January, [00:13:00] 2020.

So this would now be two years old. Um, but, but actually, um, what, what we’ve seen is that the engagement is lower now than it was two years ago. So I’m gonna, I’m going to give them numbers from two years ago, because this is actually a, it’s a little bit of a landmine. So yes. When we talk about employee engagement, we’re talking like personal engagement and disengagement at work.

So it’s basically the employee’s ability to harness their full self if you will at work. Right? So, so what the research shows an engaged employee who’s able to harness their full self will display loyalty and ownership. Which loyalties? Uh, I don’t like that word. Um, cause I think, I think loyalty in the workplace is dead.

Cause it’s got to go both ways and it’s not going both ways. Um, you know, but an example of this is that they might tackle tasks without being asked or they might anticipate the need. Right. They’ll put an extra effort in the organization, maybe. Um, Uh, they’ll do more than kind of work to rule [00:14:00] activity.

41% of employees globally are engaged in their jobs.
41% of employees globally are engaged in their jobs.

Yep. So, um, here’s, here’s what, here’s what the global employee engagement shows overall. 41% of employees globally. So 80 million responses, 41% are engaged. Interesting that doesn’t, it was a little bit high, but well, it is, it is now because I think it’s, I actually think it’s less than 30%. That was what we’re seeing.

But you say that number is high, but look at the other numbers. That means that means that 59% of employees are disengaged or actively disengaged. Can you imagine that crazy? You know, I mean, and I think we don’t have the reaction that most people would have because we, this is not new for us. Like we’ve talked, we were talking to people who were in those, in that boat.

Right. And, and I know how we get sometimes when we [00:15:00] hear it, because we know it doesn’t have to be that way. It’s not that complicated. Well, to be honest with you, Kylie probably fall in that category. I love what I do, but I love it when it’s not pandemic and where, you know, w where things were, you know, not easier, but you know, less complex.

Um, I liked it better when I could meet with clients in person. I’m sorry. All of these coaches that say coaching over the phone or coaching over zoom removes distractions, and you can get right to the point in it and it’s better. It’s better bullshit. You’re lying to yourself to make yourself feel better about coaching the way that you coach, because it is not the same.

And I can tell you that. I can tell you that wholeheartedly, it’s not the same for the coach and it’s not the same for the client. I’m not saying there’s no value. That’s not what I’m saying, but do not tell me that the coaching is more valuable, uh, through a virtual platform than it is. You cannot experience things [00:16:00] like oxytocin, uh, connection with others, the same on zoom as you can in person, it just doesn’t exist.

We have so few clients coming in our doors. These days. In person it’s all online. And so, so I fall in that disengaged category. I’m I struggle with it. It’s not as enjoyable for me. I like it when I can trade seats with a client. I like it when the client can get up to the whiteboard. Hmm. You know, I hate to say it honestly, because I know that I have clients that listen to this, but this is, you know, this is reality and you want it to go deep girl.

And I promised you I’d saved me now, girl, we’re at least six inches deep. Okay. So I’ll give you, let me, let me add something to that. No, no. Like my measurement jokes. No, no, no, no. I can be a carpenter. I’m so accurate. Um, I like the accessibility of coaching online, especially for people who are not in the area.

Cause I understand that somebody, you know, you, you get into totally understand you get a different, right. Yeah. However, I do agree with you that it isn’t necessarily [00:17:00] better, right? Those people are saying it’s going to be better because it’s online and distraction. That’s what we just say. It’s not the same.

Yeah. It’s not the same. It’s just, it’s different things. I remember just going back to a piece of, you mentioned something about loyalty. When I was first starting out at McDonald’s, I was very loyal and most companies, I think I work with, I find, I would say I’m very loyal to it. Meaning they’ve got to do a lot to me.

At McDonald's I had Ketchup in my blood.
At McDonald’s I had Ketchup in my blood.

To me to get me pissed off. Cause I was drinking the Kool-Aid, you know, at McDonald’s I had ketchup in my blood, you know, it’s I bought into these things and I loved it. I loved the environment, all these other things. Right. That’s what we used to say. You have ketchup in your blood and at WestJet, you know, like gap teal, teal, and Navy in the Kool-Aid, you know, you’re drinking the Kool-Aid and, and here’s the thing, but I found.

When they started, you know, the people and these are people I’ve worked for right. Started to piss me off, not treat me fairly, you know, not treating others around me fairly. Then I became disengaged and I didn’t actually carry more. I didn’t want to show up for extra shifts. I didn’t do above and [00:18:00] beyond that I would naturally do.

I just felt I was just counting. Five more minutes until I need 10 more minutes until I leave. Right. And that level of disengagement, even though some of us may be faking it to her, make it kind of thing, be like, oh, hi, how are you? We didn’t care. And there’s so much just being lost on that. I didn’t like that feeling.

And when that feeling happens to me, that’s how I know I needed to get out. Every time that feeling has happened no matter where I am, where I feel I’m getting more and more disengaged for me. I couldn’t stay there for just the paycheck. I’ve left jobs with no jobs. I think that resonates with a lot of people. Kyle, I think the problem is though, is that people choose to live in that pain for too long.

You know, the funny thing is, is we’re in a really messed up place right now. If you think about it, it’s also an opportunistic place in Canada. We are in a labor shortage right now, and they actually predict that this is going to last about 10 years. So they’re talking about the great resignation and stuff like this, where.

Are you actively Disengaged?
Are you actively Disengaged?

You [00:19:00] know, they’re disengaged. So they’re resigning, no plan, no, nothing. Um, that a little bit of that’s happening here, but it’s not really happening here. What BDC came out and said is that actually because COVID expedited, baby boomers leaving the workforce. Um, and it slowed down immigration. They’re actually expecting a labor shortage for about 10 years.

Um, and sometimes more intense than others. It’ll be Countrywide. What’s interesting is that you have that labor shortage compared with disengagement. And if I was an employee right now, I would be hedging my bets and asking for everything that I wanted. If I wanted a raise, if I wanted more time off, if I wanted a hybrid work situation, I would ask for it.

I wouldn’t necessarily walk out the door if I didn’t get it. But I would ask for it. If I was an employer, I would be thinking about how I can engage my employees. Money will matter for sure. You can’t because people will leave for money. But the thing is, is that it’s not, if they leave it’s about what they’re leaving for.

It’s okay. If they come back, if they’re [00:20:00] good people, so you have to offer them something. So yeah, you got to check the. Paycheck box, but a lot of companies are not going to be able to do that. Businesses will go out of business that are amazing businesses because they just can’t hire people and sustain their revenues.

Right. Because it’s going to be expensive. So just, just a second. So, so, so if I was, if I was an employer, I would be looking at other forms of engagement salary. Does not equal engagement people on both sides of that fence need to understand that whether you are an employee or an employer, you need to recognize that salary does not equal engagement.

You have to be more innovative than that. I have a few more stats I want to run through, but I’ll let you talk now. Go ahead. Yeah. Thank you. You know, equitable talking time, but anyway, keep hoping here’s the thing based on what you just said. Well, I read somewhere that over in Alberta alone, over 200,000 people have left the workforce of food services and a [00:21:00] lot of them are saying they’re going to office jobs and going to other jobs.

Here’s what I thought was interesting about. Is that the, uh, some of the employers and food services are saying, Hey, we’re going to have to raise prices now to compete with that labor. And I’m like, what the F. Folks, Kyle and I are going to stop this podcast right now, but this is definitely a two-parter because we got involved in Kyle wanted to get to 10 inches deep and the size matters early.

Six or seven or eight inches cause size matters. Uh, so stay tuned. Come in next week. It’s our goal to build a global community of inspired action takers, and we can only do that with your help. So if you love inspired action, please leave a review on your favorite podcasting app and share us on your socials you’ve heard from us.

Now we want to hear from you go to inspired action [00:22:00] and tell us what is the inspired action you took this week? Next week on inspired action for imperfect humans. Here’s what I find in my experience. A lot of middle managers don’t really like to manage back up. They don’t push back girl. They don’t give them an opportunity to really say, I mean, I hear you, but who would know.

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